dead IDE controller, or something else?

In article <alison-82B8B3.15231925042004 DeleteThis @news.newsguy.com>,
alison wonderland <alison DeleteThis @thisisntvalid.com> wrote:

 > I have a desktop G4 450Mhz with two internal (80Gb) hard drives fitted.
 > I left my computer on overnight, and when I came to it this morning it
 > was asleep, and making a weird clicking, over and over and over again,
 > about once every two seconds. I couldn't get it to do anything at all,
 > so I eventually unplugged it and restarted. It wouldn't find a startup
 > disk, but kept on making the clicking sound. I shut it down again,
 > restarted it using my OS 10.3 install disk. It eventually found the CD,
 > and started up, but it kept on clicking for several minutes. Eventually
 > the clicking stopped, around the time the installer appeared.
 >
 > Anyway, I selected "Disk Utility" instead of trying to reinstall the
 > system, but Disk Utility couldn't see any of my Hard Drives at all... It
 > could see my iPod, which was still mounted in its dock, and it could see
 > its own disk, but neither of the hard drives.
 >
 > It seems unlikely to me that both hard drives would fail at the same
 > time. Does this mean that the controller for the drives is more likely
 > to have failed?
 >
 > I'm disinclined to take this to an Apple repairer (or Apple) since it's
 > out of warranty and I've discovered through experience that I can
 > replace most computer parts myself. But I don't want to buy two new hard
 > drives if it's actually the controller that's at fault.
 >
 > How do I tell what the problem is?
 >
 > Also, if it is the controller, can anyone tell me what I need to do to
 > replace it?
 >
 > Please reply in the newsgroup. Thanks.
 >
 > Alison

Every time I have seen this (3 times now) the drive in question has been
dead. If there are more than 1 drive on the bus and the clicking drive
is the master, it will usually stop the slave from mounting as well.
Get ready to replace a drive....
--
Winner of the Prestijiouse "Fijords" Award<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: dead IDE controller, or something else? 

alison wonderland <alison.RemoveThis@thisisntvalid.com> wrote:

 > It seems unlikely to me that both hard drives would fail at the same
 > time. Does this mean that the controller for the drives is more likely
 > to have failed?
if one fails and is connected to the same cable it could cause the other
one to disfunction.
Did you try connecting just one of them (or each alone) Have a look at
the correct master / slave settings and try. And what about the
CD-ROM-drive? (which is connected to the controller, too...)
Greetings Frank<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: dead IDE controller, or something else? 

alison wonderland <alison DeleteThis @thisisntvalid.com> writes in article <alison-82B8B3.15231925042004 DeleteThis @news.newsguy.com> dated Sun, 25 Apr 2004 15:23:20 +1000:
 >It seems unlikely to me that both hard drives would fail at the same
 >time. Does this mean that the controller for the drives is more likely
 >to have failed?

If the 2 hard drives were on the same IDE bus, only 1 of them is probably
bad, most likely the one you were using as a system disk. The clicking over
and over is OS X stupidly re-trying to access the data. In this case, the
abort/retry/ignore dialog would have at least given some warning so that you
could attempt a partial backup.

-- spud_demon -at- thundermaker.net
The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: dead IDE controller, or something else? 

I have an iMac with the same problem, first the clicking sound then a grey
screen.

My CD drive and the hard drive is connected to the same cable.

I try booting from the CD drive by pressing `C` but it won`t work. (The
clicking sound continues)

Is it because they are connected to the same cable and the master/slave
setting?

How to test the system before I buy a new HD drive.

Thanks to anyone who reply.
 >> Stay informed about: dead IDE controller, or something else? 

If you have a copy of Diskwarrior or Techtools start up disk this would
be a good time to try it. Your description suggest a mechanical problem
so these programs will not help.

I am adding this after I typed this:
Try starting up from the original G4 disk (OS 9) before proceeding.
Holding down the option will let you know which drive volumes are
available to you or just press the C key. It is possible that the
second drive will be visible under 9.

I doubt that it is the controller but I would not rule it out.
I would suggest trying to determine which drive is making the noise.
  Have the case door open,press start up, place your hand on the top
drive and feel for the clicking.

Once you determine which drive is making the clicking sound, disconnect
the power and ata cable from that drive. Set the other drive to master
and connect the end of the cable to this drive. Now try to startup from
your 10.3 disk to determine if the second drive can be found. If the
drive does not show up I would go to the original G4 startup disk to see
if you experience a different result(OS 9).

If after all of the above does not work, you could look for a firewire
enclosure ( I like ByTec ME320f) to put the non-clicking drive in, or a
pci drive controller to try your first thought(bad controller) or a new
drive.

dealmac.com is a good place to look for a good value(you should be able
find a 120~160 drive for under a $100 after rebates look for a drive
with 8mb cache 7200rpm).

Note: If you are concerned about recovering data from the clicking drive
you could try chilling the drive (as in your freezer fro a bout 20 min),
hook the drive up again and try to start up ( holding down the option
key on start up should let you know if the drive is available for start
up and if you are not hearing the clicking). It is possible that after
chilling the drive it could come back.

If your G4 has an AGP slot it can be startup from an external firewire
drive.
I am not an Apple tech, these are things that I have tried in the past
that has yield good results.



alison wonderland wrote:
It wouldn't find a startup
 > disk, but kept on making the clicking sound. I shut it down again,
 > restarted it using my OS 10.3 install disk. It eventually found the CD,
 > and started up, but it kept on clicking for several minutes. Eventually
 > the clicking stopped, around the time the installer appeared.

 > I'm disinclined to take this to an Apple repairer (or Apple) since it's
 > out of warranty and I've discovered through experience that I can
 > replace most computer parts myself. But I don't want to buy two new hard
 > drives if it's actually the controller that's at fault.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: dead IDE controller, or something else?